Perhaps in the future cars will not only record your face but also listen in for hate speech. Most cars have SOS and GPS modules so calling the police if someone in the car shouts a slur is just connecting some code together.
Why do you think this is only going to be in Europe? This will be the global norm modulo some astroid hitting earth or civilizational crash.
The trajectory is crystal clear: access to information (AI), control over personal finance (CBDC), privacy of personal communications (handful of big tech MITM in everything), metered social interactions (today China, tomorrow the world over).
It is cheaper for the government to just lock the car doors for the length of your sentence. Saves them space in prison. You are allowed to use the McDrive twice a day. The windows will drop 8 centimeters, enough for a Big Mac.
> The worst thing I have to hide is knowledge about my intentions, none of which are bad/illegal/immoral.
Correction: None of which are bad/illegal/immoral _right now_. The "I have nothing to hide" crowd will surely change their tune the moment any of their data starts to be used against them.
The Chat Control 1.0 rule is simply that organisations like Meta are allowed to scan messages if they want to. In other words your Facebook messages are not private from Facebook. Surely we already knew and expected that.
Chat Control 2.0 is the worrying one because it mandates scanning and bans E2EE.
These two things should not have both been given the same branding.
Yes but that's how all of these objectionable legislations are introduced - first it's voluntary, then they wait a bit and say "companies aren't doing it, we'll need to make it mandatory".
Easier to push through if the only thing they're changing is "may" to "must".
I think the name is meaningless to the average layman, therefore useless. Something like "(private) chat police" would probably transmit what this is about but is not as catchy.
I think that framing would be much more vulnerable to companies saying "no no, there's no human reading your chats, we just want to apply these fixed filters".
Somewhat unsurprisingly too, since the negotiations about a more comprehensive CSAM legislation (the one that now doesn't contain chat control 2.0) isn't done yet.
The EU's position on privacy seems pretty consistent to me - they're against your data being monetized by private entities but not against building governmental tools to monitor private entities.
In good faith this could be summarized as "Personal data should be used for public safety but not for profit" - but that philosophy is definitely a strong contrast with the basic American philosophy towards civil liberties.
The unquestioned view in certain circles - including here - is that when the EU/UK does something that chips away at people's online privacy, there's un ulterior motive.
It's entirely possible that politicians just want to do something about CSAM and young people having their mind twisted by social media. The electorate do seem to be keen on some sort of action.
It seems fairly consistent, doesn't it? CC 2.0 is that the government must be able to access things, and GDPR has a legal basis exemption that is defacto used every time by government entities. The general idea is that private parties cannot consent to things to each other but that residents of a place consent to being governed by the government. e.g. you can't consent to having someone jail you; but you also can't opt out of jail by the government.
Personally, the politics of Europe is really not for me, but I can see why others might find it attractive. In the end, history will show us which path is adaptive.
Not "access to ALL of your data". Also, as confusing as it might be, it is in the nature of EU (at least IMHO) to not have a clear position over multiple legislatures.
Maybe big tech weren't good a lobbying bureaucrats against GDPR but got better at lobbying in the EU for this. There's also been a slight shift towards authoritarianism in the last decade, which naturally love the possibilities of stricter communication control.
Children protection and russian propaganda are the tried and tested covers at enforcing age verification, message scanning, and probably any future pan-european surveillance network.
There's no position on privacy. They make whatever laws the corporate laws and elites like, and that furthers their own bureucratic reach. GDPR is a good way to create a "compliance moat" against smaller players, and to give the EU bureucrats more power.
Not even that. The government outsources a lot of their functions, so a LOT of organizations have access to extremely private data, where necessary.
For example, Palantir gets access to "large and diverse (government) databases with Dutch citizensā data for analysis" (including mental health treatment data) under the GPDR to help police in the Netherlands do terror investigations (from 2012 to 2019). I'm sure you can appreciate the wisdom and privacy-enhancement in that just as much as me!
There are large lists of private organizations that get access to government data about citizens ... every country has multiple (public and secret ones).
Oh, they also "failed to mention" this to parliament, and this was only discovered after a journalist got a tipoff and requested financial data about the deal ... for about 5 years. Of course, there was never even the slightest investigation into this.
I think the position can best be approximated as "companies should not be able to do this, but you should trust your government to do this to you". (That's a bad position that needs to be defeated every time it arises, but it's a consistent position.)
You don't have to use Amazon/Meta/Google. You have to use the government.
Let's not forget that these are the people and laws that are supposed to represent and help you, not the other way around. While private companies have no such obligation.
For now none of Amazon, Meta, or Google can jail you or legally do violence on you, separate you from your family, etc. Your sense of threat is extremely miscalibrated.
Not really. I know what you are playing at. The probability of the government being vindictive towards a single family, whilst not truly zero, is for almost all practical purposes zero.
The probability of a (my or your) child enduring harmful content, perpetuated and enabled by Meta/Google (in particular) is almost a certainty.
you want to provide unfettered warrantless access to all of your communications. ive been fighting against that sort of thing for approaching 40 years now.
what a crazy turning of the tides to see this comment in the gray.
i suppose the times have changed from when most people on the internet were cypherphunk. now it's common to see people say "i have nothing to hide, please scan all of my communications", unironically invoking "please think of the children".
Easier? You mean easier to duplicate? No need to split up the discussion. There's the link, welcome to continue discussing over there, instead of pushing the news back in front of the rest of those who may not have missed it.
For my fellow EU citizens, you can contact your representatives here: https://fightchatcontrol.eu/
Tough week for euros. Cars that record your face while driving and now apps snooping on communications.
Perhaps in the future cars will not only record your face but also listen in for hate speech. Most cars have SOS and GPS modules so calling the police if someone in the car shouts a slur is just connecting some code together.
Why do you think this is only going to be in Europe? This will be the global norm modulo some astroid hitting earth or civilizational crash.
The trajectory is crystal clear: access to information (AI), control over personal finance (CBDC), privacy of personal communications (handful of big tech MITM in everything), metered social interactions (today China, tomorrow the world over).
Until the sun grows in a final blaze of glory and burns all Qurans at the same time for 100 million years?
You say that like itās a bad fnord
i am interested in hearing why you think it is not god awful
I mean, I get that these things are typically matters of opinion, but if you value things like freedom and privacy, these things are objectively bad.
Car could also become judge and executioner. Swift justice is just one curve away
Drive you straight to prison
It is cheaper for the government to just lock the car doors for the length of your sentence. Saves them space in prison. You are allowed to use the McDrive twice a day. The windows will drop 8 centimeters, enough for a Big Mac.
America is leading the way on that one:
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2026/07/two-teens-learn-the-har...
Well, it is some kind of social control. People who conform, have more rights than those who reject fascism.
I wait for mandated methane sensor in everyone's anus.
Boy, do I have news for you: https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/model3/en_us/GUID-EDAD116...
the children... :)
It's not particularly effective with school shootings in the USA.
what about...
More guns?
Cars sold for the past years already record and transmit all your movements and telemetry, I'm sad to say.
Maybe they should pause on being such snobs towards American politics to take a long hard look at themselves.
test
Honestly, it is mostly a reaction to how society has evolved, for the worse. Rock and hard place.
The worst thing I have to hide is knowledge about my intentions, none of which are bad/illegal/immoral.
Scan away, I'd rather try to protect my children, other children from unscrupulous characters.
> The worst thing I have to hide is knowledge about my intentions, none of which are bad/illegal/immoral.
Correction: None of which are bad/illegal/immoral _right now_. The "I have nothing to hide" crowd will surely change their tune the moment any of their data starts to be used against them.
The Chat Control 1.0 rule is simply that organisations like Meta are allowed to scan messages if they want to. In other words your Facebook messages are not private from Facebook. Surely we already knew and expected that.
Chat Control 2.0 is the worrying one because it mandates scanning and bans E2EE.
These two things should not have both been given the same branding.
>These two things should not have both been given the same branding.
the confusion is purposeful, because it is easier to convince people that 1.0 is okay, which makes 2.0 appear like a version bump of the same thing.
āChat Controlā, along with the version numbers, is a naming invented by the opponents, not by the proponents.
huh, i stand corrected. what a massive blunder in that case.
and they should not have done that
Yes but that's how all of these objectionable legislations are introduced - first it's voluntary, then they wait a bit and say "companies aren't doing it, we'll need to make it mandatory".
Easier to push through if the only thing they're changing is "may" to "must".
The name "Chat Control" is great because it implies a lockdown on free speech and the exact consequences that are going to happen to everyone.
That's suitable for Chat Control 2.0. Applying the same name to v1 just muddies the waters, probably intentionally..
Agreed.
I think the name is meaningless to the average layman, therefore useless. Something like "(private) chat police" would probably transmit what this is about but is not as catchy.
I think that framing would be much more vulnerable to companies saying "no no, there's no human reading your chats, we just want to apply these fixed filters".
Give it time. Iāll see you in 5 years
When is it coming online? I have seen so many of these headlines that I feel it's always about to kick in, but I never get any closure.
This was online already. It is existing law that is being extended rather then expired.
Somewhat unsurprisingly too, since the negotiations about a more comprehensive CSAM legislation (the one that now doesn't contain chat control 2.0) isn't done yet.
CSAM? You mean the system the Belgian state uses to identify children online?
(not even joking https://www.csam.be/en/index.html )
Fantastic quotes for services the Belgian government offers:
"Make your life easier with CSAM"
"CSAM ensures that everyone follows the same rules"
"If you are interested in a service CSAM has to offer, please go straight to our Contact page"
Hmm, soā¦ what happened while it was online? Any scandals?
2 August 2021.
It already was in force, and EU states are presumably using it right now despite that being illegal. Only to protect the children, of course.
Each passing day we are moving closer to a dystopian state and nobody is doing anything.
People are doing something (e.g. [0][1][2]). Thatās why Chat Control 2.0 hasnāt passed and is unlikely to pass in the foreseeable future.
[0] https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/posts/chat-control/
[1] https://edri.org/our-work/european-commission-must-uphold-pr...
[2] https://freiheitsrechte.org/en/themen/freiheit-im-digitalen-...
I don't understand the EU's position on privacy. On the one hand, they enacted GDPR to give you control over access to your personal data.
On the other, they need access to all of your data.
The EU's position on privacy seems pretty consistent to me - they're against your data being monetized by private entities but not against building governmental tools to monitor private entities.
In good faith this could be summarized as "Personal data should be used for public safety but not for profit" - but that philosophy is definitely a strong contrast with the basic American philosophy towards civil liberties.
> basic American philosophy towards civil liberties.
Errrr, america does not look like country that cares about that. It does care about liberties of rich companies tho.
Exactly, that is the American philosophy being referenced.
The unquestioned view in certain circles - including here - is that when the EU/UK does something that chips away at people's online privacy, there's un ulterior motive.
It's entirely possible that politicians just want to do something about CSAM and young people having their mind twisted by social media. The electorate do seem to be keen on some sort of action.
It seems fairly consistent, doesn't it? CC 2.0 is that the government must be able to access things, and GDPR has a legal basis exemption that is defacto used every time by government entities. The general idea is that private parties cannot consent to things to each other but that residents of a place consent to being governed by the government. e.g. you can't consent to having someone jail you; but you also can't opt out of jail by the government.
Personally, the politics of Europe is really not for me, but I can see why others might find it attractive. In the end, history will show us which path is adaptive.
Not "access to ALL of your data". Also, as confusing as it might be, it is in the nature of EU (at least IMHO) to not have a clear position over multiple legislatures.
This is a wedge.
The one that passed doesn't give them access to anything. It is different from the scary one.
Maybe big tech weren't good a lobbying bureaucrats against GDPR but got better at lobbying in the EU for this. There's also been a slight shift towards authoritarianism in the last decade, which naturally love the possibilities of stricter communication control.
Children protection and russian propaganda are the tried and tested covers at enforcing age verification, message scanning, and probably any future pan-european surveillance network.
There's no position on privacy. They make whatever laws the corporate laws and elites like, and that furthers their own bureucratic reach. GDPR is a good way to create a "compliance moat" against smaller players, and to give the EU bureucrats more power.
It is simple. GDPR is aimed at private entities misusing your data. Keyword private.
Not even that. The government outsources a lot of their functions, so a LOT of organizations have access to extremely private data, where necessary.
For example, Palantir gets access to "large and diverse (government) databases with Dutch citizensā data for analysis" (including mental health treatment data) under the GPDR to help police in the Netherlands do terror investigations (from 2012 to 2019). I'm sure you can appreciate the wisdom and privacy-enhancement in that just as much as me!
There are large lists of private organizations that get access to government data about citizens ... every country has multiple (public and secret ones).
Oh, they also "failed to mention" this to parliament, and this was only discovered after a journalist got a tipoff and requested financial data about the deal ... for about 5 years. Of course, there was never even the slightest investigation into this.
https://nltimes.nl/2025/08/22/dutch-police-also-use-controve...
(paywalled) https://www.volkskrant.nl/tech/ook-nederlandse-politie-gebru...
I think the position can best be approximated as "companies should not be able to do this, but you should trust your government to do this to you". (That's a bad position that needs to be defeated every time it arises, but it's a consistent position.)
Given the choice of trust between, lets say Amazon/Meta/Google and the EU (or some European government), 9 times out of 10, the EU is the lesser evil.
You don't have to use Amazon/Meta/Google. You have to use the government.
Let's not forget that these are the people and laws that are supposed to represent and help you, not the other way around. While private companies have no such obligation.
Amazon/Meta/Google is sometimes required, nobody in the real world can get away from that.
> supposed to represent and help you, not the other way around. While private companies have no such obligation.
Exactly my point.
I've moved countries 5 times in my life. I still haven't been able to fully degoogle.
For now none of Amazon, Meta, or Google can jail you or legally do violence on you, separate you from your family, etc. Your sense of threat is extremely miscalibrated.
Not really. I know what you are playing at. The probability of the government being vindictive towards a single family, whilst not truly zero, is for almost all practical purposes zero.
The probability of a (my or your) child enduring harmful content, perpetuated and enabled by Meta/Google (in particular) is almost a certainty.
We are not required to pick amongst evils. We could, in fact, say private chats are private and end to end encryption is sacrosanct.
If you are purist and you don't live in the real world with real evils. I don't want pedophiles to have privacy.
>I don't want pedophiles to have privacy.
that is why police already have access to mechanisms to remove privacy from people suspected of being a pedophile.
The existing mechanisms are inadequate or not fit for 2026. Hence this discussion.
You are agreeing with me :)
>You are agreeing with me :)
i am absolutely not :)
you want to provide unfettered warrantless access to all of your communications. ive been fighting against that sort of thing for approaching 40 years now.
what a crazy turning of the tides to see this comment in the gray.
i suppose the times have changed from when most people on the internet were cypherphunk. now it's common to see people say "i have nothing to hide, please scan all of my communications", unironically invoking "please think of the children".
Slaves also have no right to privacy. This EU variant is doomed to failure.
[dupe] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48819008
I feel like this one should not be removed because people want to continue discussing and that's easier on a newer thread.
Easier? You mean easier to duplicate? No need to split up the discussion. There's the link, welcome to continue discussing over there, instead of pushing the news back in front of the rest of those who may not have missed it.
Different news source. But same topic.
Welcome to share the url over there. Duplicate discussion.